Many people argue that soul and spirit are unified with the body so that we never leave the body. Many jewish groups as well as law-keeping christian sects teach this doctrine. One of which was the Saducees. jesus debates them directly regarding this issue
mark 11: 18 Then come unto him the Sadducees, which say there is no resurrection; and they asked him, saying,
19 Master,
Moses wrote unto us, If a man's brother die, and leave his wife behind
him, and leave no children, that his brother should take his wife, and
raise up seed unto his brother.
20 Now there were seven brethren: and the first took a wife, and dying left no seed.
21 And the second took her, and died, neither left he any seed: and the third likewise.
22 And the seven had her, and left no seed: last of all the woman died also.
23 In the resurrection therefore, when they shall rise, whose wife shall she be of them? for the seven had her to wife.
24 And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?
25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.
26 And
as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of
Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of
Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?
27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err."
Now the Sadducees here, deny the resurrection and by implication any life after death. Jesus first indicates that the resurrection is different than this life. Marriage and reproduction will no longer be needed. But then he adds something at the end. God is a God of the living, referring to Abraham Isaac and Jacob. This implies that Abraham Isaac and Jacob are alive in the spiritual realm.
This is also agreed upon in the Old Testament.
Genesis 49:
33 And
when Jacob had made an end of commanding his sons, he gathered up his
feet into the bed, and yielded up the ghost, and was gathered unto his
people.
It is obvious that Jesus did not believe in soul sleep.
Sunday, April 27, 2014
Thursday, April 24, 2014
Even the Catholic greek Bible rejected codex Vaticanus
"The famous manuscript Vaticanus (written about AD 325-350 and
considered by many modern scholars to be the most important manuscripts
in existence) is believed to have been in the Vatican sometime before
1475.
The polyglot text itself, however, shows no dependence on vaticanus."
Pg. 228 A Visual History of English Bible Daniel Brake
This dispels a myth that many of your pastors were indoctrinated with.
They, like myself, were taught that the earlier church was ignorant of the "older and better manuscripts" which are use to justify removing bible verses from the modern English bibles. (Mark 16:9-20, John 7:59-8:11 etc.etc.) the reality is, even the scholars behind the roman catholic Greek New Testament "complutesian polyglot" where well aware of this manuscript and had obviously rejected it. Our modern bibles are based upon manuscripts which Christendom rejected for 1800 years.
The polyglot text itself, however, shows no dependence on vaticanus."
Pg. 228 A Visual History of English Bible Daniel Brake
This dispels a myth that many of your pastors were indoctrinated with.
They, like myself, were taught that the earlier church was ignorant of the "older and better manuscripts" which are use to justify removing bible verses from the modern English bibles. (Mark 16:9-20, John 7:59-8:11 etc.etc.) the reality is, even the scholars behind the roman catholic Greek New Testament "complutesian polyglot" where well aware of this manuscript and had obviously rejected it. Our modern bibles are based upon manuscripts which Christendom rejected for 1800 years.
Sunday, April 20, 2014
Witness to a hypercalvinist
Here is a facebook debate I had with a calvinist who I believe is a hypercalvinst. I have removed names, so as not to villainize anyone. But I want to show the argumentation and where the theology leads. We start off with a debate over Van tillian presuppositionalism. I will label him HC
- HC: Matt, God says so.
- HC Matt, to cut to the chase, my answer will always be the same.
- HC I know because of revelation on a spiritual level.
- HC: Matt, I reason from this revelation. Revelation precedes reason.
- Matt SIngleton Ahh, but how did you understand it to begin with? after all your depravity might destroy your ability to interpret the gospel.
- HC:Matt, praise God He regenerated me, freeing me from sin.
- MATT SINGLETON
So then you would agree that we can completely understand the scriptures.
- HC: Matt, aside from the two natures, yes.
- Matt SIngleton Well, if I keep probing you on that sinful part, you know we will hit an infinite regress.
- Matt SIngleton Because there will always be error in your sinfulness and there is always the chance of you totally misinterpeting the scripture. Much like the atheist not having the ability to be certain.
- Another user: You can't argue revelation to a non-believer.
- HC: Matt, where did you that idea?
- matt singleton: admin, why not? Paul did.
- Matt SIngleton We start off with the evidence of our experience of the gospel(regeneration) this is the starting point. It is not the basis however. From experience we can conclude that regeneration is an effect from the cause which is the gospel/scripture. once we conclude that the scriptures are true then we can operate under a presuppositionalists stance.
- HC: Matt, I said nothing of my experience, for regeneration was done to me having nothing to do wit my experience.
- Matt SIngleton You have to experience regeneration at some level. Because you would experience hearing the gospel and believing the gospel.
- HC: Matt, no. Your gospel is in error. I was regenerated independent of my actions.
- Matt SIngleton romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. romans 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. do you deny this?
- A 2ND USER: Matt you are discussing things that are arbitrary to each believer, ergo how one 'feels' regenerated.... best to stick with solid presupps of uniformity based on the transcendental argument and the impossibility of the contrary
- Matt SIngleton HC regeneration is not salvation. Regeneration is the work of the Holy Spirit. Salvation is the work of Jesus Christ on the Cross.
- HC: Matt, Titus 3:5 says to the contrary. Be that as it may, our salvation is not based on our experience.
- Matt SIngleton And the point is wasted since you have no justification for interpretting scripture. which is why your argument stands nullified against atheist. You can't say my view doesn't makes sense so it matters that your view doesn't make sense. Besides God is not the author of confusion.
- HC: Matt, the point is not wasted, but wrong because it is based in that which is Biblically false. You defeated a straw man. Big deal.
- Matt SIngleton Titus 3:5
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
5 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;" I never claimed believing or confessing is a work of righteousness. paul didn't either. you do not understand the difference between an act and a work. You can be hired by mcdonalds and proclaim your belief in mcdonalds. but they will still fire you because you did not work. anact of believeing is not a work. and I hope you believe in christ imputed righteousness. - HC: Matt, you can deny reality all you want, but salvation is by grace, not what I do. To preach otherwise makes you anathema. Gal 1:6-9.
- 2nd user :And exactly the reason the God is not the author of confusion, we have his Character, his mind, and thought processes of logic and reasoning which is the authority for uniformity.In the Christian Theistic worldview, it is logical for there to be uniformity, for it is the character of God...
However, in an atheistic/natural/material/atomism worldview, how can one 'rationally' account for uniformity?
THATS the argument. - Matt SIngleton HC why do you quote scripture? How do I know that you can understand it? (besides the evidence of bad exegesis )
- HC:It is the truth, God's Word, and I do not claim you can understand it. To the contrary, I am beginning to doubt you can.
- HC: Nope, God the Son and God the Spirit are two different persons making up, with the Father, one God.
- HC: 2nd user, this is important for Matt is hearing the real gospel for the first time.
- Administrator: Hey guys, we're getting far afield of the OP here. If you want to continue this conversation, do so on Doctrine Discussion, not here. I'll delete anything else following this path. This is the wrong forum for it.
- HC: Administrator, you got it, but can you invite me to that group, please!
- ______________________________________________________________________________
At this point we went to a private conversation and things got interesting..
HC: Thanks for invite, but you have it already. Salvation is by grace, not works.
HC: Both.HC:I answered that in the group.HC:Nope.HC: Yep.HC: If by that you mean no other person in the trinity is involved in salvation, then yes, for that is heresy.HC: As I said.....HC: I never said the sinner merited salvation. If you cannot help but argue against a straw man, we need to end this conversation.HC: Faith is a work, a work of God. We are saved by grave, not by faith. Faith is the result of salvation, not it cause. In other words, I believe because I am saved. I am not saved because I believe.HC:Grace*HC:God's unmerited favor.HC: Approval, good will.HC: Is English not your first language or are you still wrestling with straw men?HC:Christ paid for the son of the elect.HC: What do you not understand?HC: Sorry, that should have been sins of the elect.HC: Some of them, such as all of the OT saints.HC:To stone for the sins of the elect (2x).HC: Atone*HC: Christ is the Lamb of God slain before the foundation of the earth.HC: Dude, you really do not understand spiritual truths do you?HC:So you poorly reason that if something confuses you, it is not of God?HC: The first sin: arrogance.HC:Because you insist salvation is by works.HC:Faith. And who knows what else.HC:God's Word says it is. LOLHC: One sec.HC:John 6:29.HC:You really need to stop impose your false philosophies on God's Word.HC:Inposing*HC:Imposing*HC: What does John 6:29 tell you?HC:Please tell us what John 6:29 tells you?HC:Ne*HC:Me*HC:That is not what it says, is it?HC:It says that belief is the work of God right?HC: Not relevant to your answer to my q. Please answer.HC:As I said...
Matt Singleton: Please answer.HC:Answer, please?HC: Well, not that I have established that you are intellectually dishonest outside of the Word and, now, within the Word, I shall not waste more time on you. Have a good one.HC:Now*
It wasn't natural for me to question this person's salvation. But I felt a conviction to do so. How could one not experience being born-again on at least some level. If you are sure that you have eternal life, shouldn't it change your perspective on life and evoke some emotion from originally believing in either no afterlife or the possibility of facing Hell? Unless one is brain damage that should evoke a response. You could argue about not having an external response. But it would at minimum evoke internal emotions, it is as tramatic as jumping off a cliffe. So how could it be a false gospel? George whitfield was ased by his followers if people believed in their heart. He responded according to romans 10:
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed."
For this man to call experiencing salvation as heresy reveals a lot to me. We must remember that we do believe in our hearts.
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed."
For this man to call experiencing salvation as heresy reveals a lot to me. We must remember that we do believe in our hearts.
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